The middle of the road ADV's Africa Twin, Norden, s10

[adventure steele]

Hi everyone hope we are all well just wondering if I can pick the groups collective knowledge on a few bikes
Just a quick edit to say for those joining the thread I'm most likley going back to a GS or GSA but I'm curious about the Tiger 900 or 1200 (know nothing about them


edited to remove the t7
I'm currently in the process of moving up to Perthshire in Scotland an next year dad and I are going to Norway the Nordkapp / Iceland.

He's gonna be taking my 300 Rally which I'm giving him after the move and I'm thinking of moving back onto a bigger bike as there's 0 lanes up Scotland an ill be about 6 hours or so from the nearest ones + I'll be doing alot of road based adventure touring to see my new home. I've also sussed out I prefer the easier lanes and overland travel rather than the harder routes on unsealed roads, preferring just to take in the views.

Which leads me onto possible bikes in the past I've had in order over a 7 year period:

R1200gsa te 2014, vstrom 1000xt, f800gs 2015, vstrom 650xt 2020, Ktm 390 adv x2 which was my initial choice for the trips alas both got rejected for refunds at 147 and 269 miles (mine and dads)

Then I had a r1200gs te Rallye for a few months unfortunately had to part with that due to some financial stuff and my shoulder.
Then I ended up with a Himalayan which got rejected at 500 miles full of issues an now the Honda 300 Rally which has been flawless since I put the Rally Raid Rear shock on.

I'll be covering quite high miles with not having a car an wanting to keep the miles down on my Nortons (used a 650ss as a daily for 4 years inc winters) I'm also leaning towards something with good weather protection as buffeting can set my neck off now an im fancying the smoothness of a twin. Where as dad prefers the lightness of the Rally.

Has anyone had the Super 10 What did you prefer for mainly adventure touring with some easier gravel routes n roads thrown in?

I also thought the Norden 901 seemed to fit the bill an that was the initial plan if the 390s had worked out but I wanted to try the brand first so guess I'm trying to find the Japanese equivalent split wise for adventure touring. It's a shame to see the 390 SW still has the same display when the others have an updated one.

An finally for anyone that's been to Icleland, Norway and Nordkapp with that in mind does anyone have any advice on routes or places to check out as I'm starting to replan the trip. Probably got 8 weeks to spend out there

Curious to hear from those that have had a Super Ten for 80-20 road /unsealed road riding what are they like to live with from that respect an same for the tiger 900 an 1200.

Whos moved to those from the GSA or GS LC
I thought I'd get a Vstrom 800De £900 with suzuki insurance but the insurance is a bit mad on it an not many were quoting same for the transalp.

Where as the 2019 AT was £300 fully comp, my Rally is £600 with the shock( just gone up at renewal) T7 £600-700 World Raid £900
Clean licence no points max no claims and a good post code mid 30's paying more now that I used to for my blade lol

Once I'm back in work it's an one issue but after the move and the trip I'll be down as unemployed so it's a consideration at the mo.

Thanks in advance.

[Richard Simpson Mark II]

The base model T7 is probably the most uncomplicated and reliable bike on your list.
If you aren't doing serious off-road on it, then the 16 litres of fuel sloshing about at the top of the bike won't be too much of a handicap.
Hold their money, too.
If my local Yam dealer hadn't have been staffed by morons, I'd have considered one.
My fault I know. I can cope with arrogance, I can cope with ignorance, but the combination of the two...

[adventure steele]

Thanks mate yep I can totally get that I've not bought bikes in the past for that exact reason, gotta go in for parts etc sometimes, gonna be popping into a few dealers in Scotland while I'm up this week to get a feel for them.

That's one thing I've found that I love with the 300 Rally everything just works apart from the rear shock but that was fixable the rally raid level 1 was a light and day difference. No condensation in displays no brake issue or sensor issues so far touch wood nothing to put up with. So I'm happy to let my old man have it as he's constantly eyeing it up lmao so that's dad sorted I did think about getting a 2nd one but thought it'd be interesting to have two different takes on it an something that's more suitable for what I'm liking now for my adventure travel riding.

It's a real shame that Ktm didn't put the new type display off the other bikes onto the 390 SW version now they all have a new type display without the housing.

I think they always forget the Kiss Philosophy in design.

Would love to see some 400-500 twins From Yam.

[minkyhead]

cant keep track of thee lad

t7 is a decent tourer suffers from harsh crashy road suspension and needs a better seat and screen solution ,,,its badly undergeared as standard for long distance 16t front makes it the same as its stablemates and makes much more sense for touring .. mpg average and on motorways at 80/85mph you are getting pretty worried at 140miles in total over my ownership the trip was at a 53mpg average
i rode the de800 last thusday and its nowt much to write home about tbo ..very exposed and basic ..nice engine mind

tbo id just buy a road bike and forget the adv thing ...im being honest when i say me vesys 650 is a way better tourer than my t7 ever was 17inch tubless wheels pilot road tyres 2l litre tank 100 miles more range than the t7 much better feul consumption for sure ..250mile min tank range .. better weather protection . adjustable screen .comfier .tighter turning circle ..closer to the floor .much nicer dash . traction control .. very good intergrated panniers on the free deals .. very good in the bends ... much more compliant plusher suspension for the road
bought online delivered with free luggage 7700 quid
some 2400 quid cheaper than a current base t7 ..i really dont miss mine at all in any way sure its not in fashion but its a better road bike than the t7 is ... period
..when i got me t7 i paid 7700 quid at 10100 its way way overpriced imho by the time you have a centre stand a must for tubled tyres and some luggage solutions its far too much for what it is ... id by pass it compleatly and get a tracer gt for 12k

failing that ... the dl650 as a daily rider would be my choice reliable bullet proof easy to maintain never need a dealer . cheap to rack miles up on wont cost the earth to replace

[Paul_C]

I'm pleased with my 901. Had my previous GSA LC for a few years selling it with 63k done. Great bike but time for a change. 901 is clearly lighter and less powerful although I haven't really noticed a power loss. I'm 5'6" and the GSA had a low Sargent seat which was excellent. The 901 is about the same height and feels equally comfortable. I've ridden it on gravel trails which it manages with ease. For distance riding the screen is poor, I replaced mine with the one off the Expedition model which is good. Suspension needed a bit of experimentation to get it to suit but that's part of the fun. I also fitted an AXP skid plate, some upper crash bars and some Oxford heated grips. The Expedition model is good value compared with the standard one but, by all accounts, the panniers are inadequate.

[adventure steele]

hi Minky lemme try explain some of the thinking

I'd classify the sort of riding I love doing now is long distance adventure travel, crunching big miles and seeing new places.

No complaints at all with the 300 rally apart from the seat an the (shock sorted that) dad's taken a serious liking to it at the moment as he isn't into the heavier bikes to be fair if it wasn't for dad suggesting the lighter bike thing an some green laning I'd still be on my DL650XT.

I might still end up with another 300 Rally yet but I'm bored out of my head on the laptop waiting for the washing machine to dry the clothes for going Scotland tomorrow an we all know where that leads haha bike research!

The easiest option would be to get a 2nd one put the same shock on an I might still end up doing that as we've only one bike at the mo modern wise which is my 300 rally so it's whether to get same again or stick with the original plan which is a 2nd bike to try.

Yep I loved absolutely loved the Dl650 that or the 800DE was my main choice so really interesting to hear about the 800 thanks for sharing mate.

I've missed the DL650 since I sold it. Until I did up to date insurance quotes on them I dunno what's going on with the Suzukis' but really shot up.

I really wanted to give the green laning a go but I'm just not to mad on the technical stuff yet really enjoyed stuff like Houndkirk after the first section from Fox house those rocks took some getting used to lol and loved Sir William Hill Road after Id done it an was relaxing a few 890s came down which set me thinking.

It's been a good opportunity to figure out whether I liked that type of riding an the 300 was the perfect bike for it being so manageable. Mainly sticking with the adv ish stuff for the seating position for my neck and the wind protection again for my neck an for comfort covering distance while still having some capability for gravel roads on the trip an Iceland. I'll have access to the 300 though as dad an I live together for any goes at laning I wanna do in the future.

If we had stuck with moving to Devon the Rally would be the absolute perfect bike but with Scotland and 0 lanes it's got me thinking that something like the Norden (if it wasn't a Ktm based on our previous problems with the 390s either that or just bad luck) that's still ok to go down a few light lanes on weekends away to the lakes etc.

I still reckon in many ways the initial choice an research on the 390s was the right bike mix wise for us but the issues and what happened with the dealer screw ups on dads at pdi and damage / corrosion to both bikes from poor QC that wasn't spotted at first + the display faults lead to the refund / rejection.

I did think about just getting a GS again as that also ticked alot of the boxes but don't wanna get back on with the bmw service prices + warranties.
Which was the thinking behind the T7 looking at it's reputation for the CP2 engine an the capability of the bike but the more I'm reading while suffering the old man watching football has left me a bit doubtful whether it's the right move hence asking the questions.

I'd say to simplify it

Good commuting ability
600 mile days in comfort (about once a month I'll be having to trek back to Manchester to visit a relative) (vstrom used to do those with ease)

Good wind Management not a GSA in weight so somewhere in between.

Not to mad on the insurance.

Reliable which leant me towards the Japanese bikes.

Comfort is probably the top of the list.

Smoothness hence thinking a twin.

Good on road handling and capability to go down some gravel lanes.

Engine wise doesn't need to be a rocket but have some character hence thinking Africa Twin rather than CB500X for the firing order.

600 mile days in comfort like the Vstrom 650XT


The weirdest thing with the DL 650 is the insurance price when I had mine it was 500 then jumped to 600 I did a quote on one the other day an its up to 900 with Bemoto or 500 with Bennett's with Bemoto on MCN compare thought it was crazy for a 2020 bike. Back in work it drops to about 300-500

the Africa Twin from 2019 is about 300 quid with everyone guessing that's with Honda's hiss as the 500x was 180.

That then lead me to the thought on the Africa Twin. A bike I'm not overly familiar with but a few people I used to know really rated them although I've seen the early ones had a few issues hence I thought I'd just ask a few questions on here for those that are knowledgeable about them.

Having like the GS I also thought about the Super Ten but I know nothing bout them yet apart from shaft drive.

[adventure steele]

Thanks Paul that's really interesting on the 901 I must admit it really caught my attention as I think they look bril an like the travel ethos of them, how are you getting on with it any issues? if you don't mind me asking.

[minkyhead]

dunno having had a t7 i thought id try it as they have a demo...got some video somwhere ...dont get me wrong it is a nice bike but its really not a lot better or worse than a t7 except it is deffo minamilist in the weather protection catagory ...its ticket price is 10600 ..again luggage tubed tyres centre stand and a really naff placcy bashplate if u could call it that ..then you getting very very close to some pretty capable touring bikes with a much higher spec and when i accept they are too much for me on the uk tracks they start to make little sense ..for instance when i put a e09 on the t7 to trail it it pretty much dissapeared before my eyes past its off road best at 900 miles and pretty much shot at at 1600 ..that then in turn made it a but shonky to push very hard on the roads which then in turn defeated the point of having the motor somewhat ...the alternative .cats paw tyres and a shower of rain are for heros in owt remotly green .... and i aint one
suzuki was nice to ride but it wasnt honestky blowing me away in anyway shape or form ..i think ive got it right for me road bike road tyres for the road and light is might for the bumpy stuff ..a good road tyre when it digs in has a lot going for it and vice versa ...i find it difficult to get the tyres right on these big bangers ...kinda ruins it alittle either way for me ...

try one very nice ...got a lot more trickery than the t7 for sure ..is that a good thing ...i dunno

it is kind of strange it does look better than the picures when you next to it ...just as well i think some will say .. funny but it does

[Hoggyf]

Paul C - interested to know what you needed to do to the Norden to fit at 5'6" and if it's not rude, what inside leg are you? I like the looks but I'm a midget with stumpy legs

[Godspeed]

Go really different and get a PCX125


“Good commuting ability
(You can’t get better than a 130mpg, lightweight easily manoeuvrable machine)
600 mile days in comfort (about once a month I'll be having to trek back to Manchester to visit a relative) (vstrom used to do those with ease)
I’ve done 485miles in a day and that was pretty much all on back roads so you could do close to that

Good wind Management not a GSA in weight so somewhere in between.
Yep, high screen and you can ride with an open face helmet, and weighs like 130kg

Not to mad on the insurance.
Cheap as chips
Reliable which leant me towards the Japanese bikes.
Yep, got that covered
Comfort is probably the top of the list.
You can’t get much more comfortable than a pcx, as there are so many feet positions
Smoothness hence thinking a twin.
Smooth as a baby’s bottom
Good on road handling and capability to go down some gravel lanes.
Lovely handling, you can really throw it about, and yes very gentle gravel lanes could be attempted
Engine wise doesn't need to be a rocket but have some character hence thinking Africa Twin rather than CB500X for the firing order.
Just make brum, brum noises or use a sena for some banging tracks

Purchase price of about 3.5K and get 240 miles out of 8 litres of fuel.

Thank me after you’ve bought it