Byway's Section

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mancunian
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Re: Byway's Section

Post by mancunian »

timmyhifi wrote:The byways are public routes. Not owned by the TRF. The TRF do great work, but the secrecy around byways is getting really old now IMHO.

Illegal rider arguments don't wash anymore, as most illegal riders don't get enough of a thrill from the green lanes.

And people should be able to access the routes without having to be tied to the TRF.

That is why all councils have a definitive map of the legal byways.
The Tarmac roads are public as well, is an A to Z free or do you have to pay for it ?
timmyhifi
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Re: Byway's Section

Post by timmyhifi »

mancunian wrote:
timmyhifi wrote:The byways are public routes. Not owned by the TRF. The TRF do great work, but the secrecy around byways is getting really old now IMHO.

Illegal rider arguments don't wash anymore, as most illegal riders don't get enough of a thrill from the green lanes.

And people should be able to access the routes without having to be tied to the TRF.

That is why all councils have a definitive map of the legal byways.
The Tarmac roads are public as well, is an A to Z free or do you have to pay for it ?
If you read my post again, you will see that all I am saying is that the information on routes is available for free publicly by consulting the council in the area you wish to ride.

The TRF is not a tour organiser. It's a group that uses subscription monies to fight restrictions and reclassifications of byways. They also invest in organising volunteers to reinstate and maintain some of these byways.

They will also provide legal assistance to riders of legal lanes if the legality of where they are riding is contested and they are dragged through the courts.

The advice on here of "join the TRF" to find out where you can ride is a misinformed piece of guidance.

I am merely stressing the point that the routes are set out and defined with each council.
sexysi
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Re: Byway's Section

Post by sexysi »

As I said before, If anyone comes down to Kent and wants to join one of our rideouts, we are more than happy to share the knowledge.
We have no secrets down here, and to be honest with you, if it is the first time out on your brand spanking new Adventure bike, it is always good to go with someone who knows that lane.
It is sometimes bloody hard to pick up a big bike by yourself and If you ride by yourself and you could come off and break something, bike or yourself, who is going to help you then!!!!

We have a set of steps on one of our rides, if you have never done a green lane before, i would say you really need to think first before you try them. Go out with someone who has done them before and knows what to expect and they will walk you through the route first.
Some of these big BMW's are worth 10 grand plus. If i think that it couldn't handle the steps then i would take a newbee around them and meet the rest of the group at the bottom.

That way that person can still enjoy the rideout, but not damaged their pride and joy.

On our first rideout I would say 8 out of our 10 green lanes are easy and would say that only 2 are medium difficulty level, in the dry and this is on road type tyres. So I believe that a bit of local knowledge is much better than getting a map and just going for it!!!!

The TRF are a good group, but I still believe that they are still more geared up for smaller off road bikes. ie: a Tigger 1200 or BMW 1200 are slower at doing the off road stuff and when dropped, become a pain to get back up.

Si
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sexysi
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Re: Byway's Section

Post by sexysi »

Also on the first ride we did, we did have a Tiger 1200 come with us, and yes the guy did drop it on the steps that were damp. I did ask the guy if he wanted to try them and we all walked the steps first. This was a Tiger 1200, but a road version. So alloy wheels, not a lot of clearence. My man concern was him cracking a alloy, as the rest of us were on spoked, strong off road wheels.

He said he was happy so that was that. He tried it and dropped it.
We did managed to bend back his gear selector (Alloy version) back at the bottom of the hill and he completed the ride. It hasn't put him off and I think he was glad that there were 4 other guys looking out for him.

For us it is about having some safe fun with similar people enjoying the lanes of Kent. I must admit I prefer to ride as a group, with people that know what they are doing. Between us we can overcome any problem and make sure everybody gets home after a safe ride and of course have a chat in the pub afterwards.

Not really into the "Norman no mates idea" ;)

si
Oh, Edmund, can it be true, that I hold here in my mortal hand a nugget of purest green?



2013 Triumph tiger 800 xc

1998 Honda XR 250L

2003 CCM 404 DS

2005 MGTF

https://www.youtube.com/user/kentbyways

http://www.kent-byways.co.uk/









Oop North John
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Re: Byway's Section

Post by Oop North John »

So how do the "I'm keeping quiet about my roads" feel about the magazine publishing guides / maps to them?
Willy_Eckerslike
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Re: Byway's Section

Post by Willy_Eckerslike »

Oop North John wrote:So how do the "I'm keeping quiet about my roads" feel about the magazine publishing guides / maps to them?
I would imagine most of the people who buy the magazine either a: already know where the lanes are or can read a map or b: don't want to risk getting their two wheeled touratech showroom scratched.
A ship is safe in harbour, but that’s not what ships are for. – Grace Hopper
sexysi
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Re: Byway's Section

Post by sexysi »

Mike54 wrote:I don't agree. Once you start posting routes those routes get overused by people too lazy to research their own. All the information is out there anyway, the last thing we need is for it to be all in one central point on the internet, accessible to every law breaker and moron out there. So no, sorry.
Erm Mike, as has just been pointed out, maybe the ABR mag should remove all of the routes, with OS references from all of it's mags, never to produce this information again.
Trouble is an article that is titled "Green Lanes in your area" wouldn't read very good if all it said was "Sorry, go buy an OS map and talk to the local council you lazy git!!!"

So the mag does it already, and all I was asking was a central location for said reports.

si
Oh, Edmund, can it be true, that I hold here in my mortal hand a nugget of purest green?



2013 Triumph tiger 800 xc

1998 Honda XR 250L

2003 CCM 404 DS

2005 MGTF

https://www.youtube.com/user/kentbyways

http://www.kent-byways.co.uk/









Richard Simpson
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Re: Byway's Section

Post by Richard Simpson »

Personally, I'd rather the magazines published guides on how to find lanes using resources in the public domain, and how the law works regarding their use.

Back in the 1970s and 1980s, there were loads of articles published on 'Trail riding/4x4 driving on the Ridgeway'

It turned the Ridgeway into a bit of a free-for-all, and the result of it is that most of it is now closed to vehicles.

More recently, the Bauer magazines have become obsessed with "The Viking Way': a designated long-distance footpath, only some parts of which have vehicular rights, that was already overused in places.

The truth is that it's not difficult to find vehicular rights of way: when I turned up at my first TRF meeting I took along my own maps, with routes that I had ridden, and 'showed and shared'.

In contrast, I've known people turn up at TRF group meetings, and demanding to be given(!) a set of marked-up maps, then take offence when asked if they are members, have read the CoC etc.


They then go on a forum or two and complain about the TRF being a 'click' (I think they mean clique!).

A few years ago, I got MCN to put this
http://www.motorcyclenews.com/MCN/Ridin ... EPI-128228

on their website.

Which is the sort of thing that I'd like to see more magazines publish.

Sadly folk now want a 'plug and play' solution, and most magazines want to run cover tasters like:

"Let Rip! Ten exciting green lanes that you can tear up tomorrow"

OK, I made that one up, but it's the kind of line that gets the man in the suit from marketing nodding in a publishing company 'cover clinic'
Mike54
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Re: Byway's Section

Post by Mike54 »

Oop North John wrote:So how do the "I'm keeping quiet about my roads" feel about the magazine publishing guides / maps to them?
I don't mind that at all as long as the locations are crystal clear. There was an uproar last year when a certain offroad mag (not bike related) did a load of routes but put the locations and routes in by tulip diagrams. What happened next were some very angry farmers because the people driving the routes were getting lost. Also, in the articles, there were pictures of vehicles off the main route which is THE biggest no no there is. It gave a load of ammo to the antis. It seems a lot of people don't realise (or don't care) that you MUST stay on the route, not veer off it for a little excursion where you feel like it.

If mags want to publish routes that's cool, but they should do so realising that they have a responsibility. The world is full of lazy people who would rather just follow someone else rather than find out stuff and I'm pleased that the mags aren't publishing full days riding routes. At least that way a person has to half a brain to put them together and plan a full days riding. I don't want signs and I don't want permits.

ps "I'm keeping quiet about my roads" is totally misleading, since the information is available to ANYONE who can be bothered to look.
-Ralph-
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Re: Byway's Section

Post by -Ralph- »

Part of the issue with 'publicising' routes, is that the general public don't have a appreciation of the rest of the laws surrounding green laning. All they read is, "it's legal to ride your motorbike here", so they stick wee Johnnys unregistered crosser on the trailer and pay the lane a visit.

The number of bike trailers I see parked at the end of some of my local green lanes, with crossers getting loaded or unloaded. Why have they bought them on a trailer to a byway or UCR, rather than just use a footpath nearer to home? Because they know they can't use the footpath nearer home, but are under the false perception that if they do it on a green lane it's legal.
"Luke, you're going to find that many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view" - Obi-Wan Kenobi
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