French Abr Rally

[Simon_100]

I wish I'd been aware of this topic when it first appeared.

Having organised the original HISS rally - which I realised from the start was incompatible with the ABR guidelines as they existed at the time and agreed with Alun that things would have to be different - I think that anyone who thinks the can organise an 'ABR' rally according to all the guidelines (lets not say 'rules') abroad is totally naive.

Obviously there are the local rule and regs to consider, as Britfrog pointed out, but you have to take into account how competent, sensible and responsible folks behave once they are over - or under - the channel.

Examples:

I spent a day accompanying an injured rider at the local hospital with a) no EU 106 public health cover insurance, b) no private health insurance c) inadequate holiday insurance that wouldn't cover his repatriation.

Having spend months working out routes that were legal, taking into account that the Pyrenees are highly controlled - being one of Europe's last great wild environments - and producing details route guides, which for the 2012 HISS were an optional purchase - I had the dubious pleasure of watching a Youtube video of HISS riders smashing though one of the most sensitive - and highly protected environments of all: a breeding ground of one of the WORLDS most endangered vulture species.

Not only was this Youtube posted by a doyen of the TRF but, much more importantly, it trashed my personal reputation with the managers of the region concerned - worse still as I also happen to live here!

And the money . . .

Well, The original HISS left me some hundreds out of pocket when you consider the time it took to organise - and some rumours had it that I was getting a kick-back from the camp site, with whom I had negotiated an discount for the participants - all of which took me away from other stuff.

But also the costs of riding the trails, buying maps and researching the rules, trips to the local police departments, town halls - of which there are several in Spain all of whom have to be 'happy'!

Plus we also laid on a big breakfast for everyone on the day they left. So, the camp site got a 'tip' - having made a small fortune - and we ended up doing the dishes. Great, gives you faith in human nature.

So, this year I ask for some cash to cover all this. Result, no reply to emails from anyone at ABR ever since. A very curious way to run a business. Enjoy running your French rally.

Regs

Simon

PS the 2013 HISS starts next weekend with several lovely people returning, having had a fantastic time last year, and many more being sad that they can't come for various personal reasons. In place of the 400 kms of trails that were in last year's guide there are now ell over 500 kms - all of which are totally legal and offer riders the chance to trail for over 100 miles at a time without hitting the black stuff for more than a few miles at a time.

Some treats in store for them:

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[Tramp]

is this the video on you tube you are refering to.. if so what about the spanish 4x4 drivers and enduro bikers we came across..not forgetting to mention the farmers and walkers..all who where polite and happy to see us :whistle:

[Simon_100]

is this the video on you tube you are refering to..





if so what about the spanish 4x4 drivers and enduro bikers we came across..not forgetting to mention the farmers and walkers..all who where polite and happy to see us :whistle:

No Russ, absolutely not. Nowhere near.

The riders I'm talking about rode straight past this:

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You'll see that it's not what you might call unambiguous!

In this particular case there was a conventional 'No-Enrty sign warning about this about twelve kilometres away from the actual prohibited area too - helpful so that folks don't waste their time!

What really bugs me is that with literally thousands of miles of free space why f*** up the few kilometres that are controlled!

Regs

Simon

[Rhys]

So who was it then...

[Simon_100]

So who was it then...

Hi Rhys,

I decided not to 'name and shame' when it happened - not my style at all. And I see no need to change my mind now. The guys that went on that run know who they are, I'll leave it up to them.

However on the same run they also went on a jolly into a tiny mountain village with 'No Entry' signs. The irony is that almost all of the 'villagers' are the kind of ex-pats who would have called the police in no time, just like Sussex really!

My real point, however, was to ask why do people do things abroad that they wouldn't do at home. I've had actual hate mail from ex-pat Brits for promoting biking in Spain. So I have a particular axe to grind when some of my so-called 'colleagues' do exactly the kind of thing these lunatics are insinuating.

In direct response to the HISS topic on this forum one of these hate mailers mentioned the TRF in particular, claiming that in its 'closed' members-only forum various forms of vigilanteism are planned. I have no idea whether this is true or not so can't comment. But when I planned a HISS, adopting the TRF guidelines as my watchword, I was astounded to notice how different reality appeared to be.

Meanwhile, I respect and admire my Spanish friends, and it must be said Spanish society in general, who obey the rules and regs.- sometimes obsessively so - even though they may disagree with them strongly and lobby hard for their rights. The Spanish forums are full of examples. But shopping someone? No, no, no!

Regs

Simon

[britfrog]

Simon, I understand your anger, here in my region there are loads of English who are happy to drive around in uk registered cars with no MOT, No insurance, no tax, the local police have had enough of it and are having a binge stopping these cars and giving them a 2000 euro fine plus confiscating the vehicle , until proof of insurance and a MOT can be produced. There are far too many expats going around making no effort to speak the local lingo French or Spanish, and acting as if the own the place and making no effort to become integrated, all they do is live in a UK enclave and this is really p---sing off the French. Of course there are some ex-pats that do make an effort to live the French life, after all this is what we came here for. My wife watches some expat forums and it absolutely staggers me what some pompous arses say on them. It goes without saying I have nothing to do with them. As I am a translator for the notaires and now the local gendarmes, they asked me to translate to a group of uk bikers that had been riding the fire trails here and were stopped by the forest rangers. The group leader had been in the region a few times before so decided to organize an offroad ride in the Pyrenees where the participants had to pay about 150 pounds a day to the leader , this was to include hotels but not food but no hotels were booked ahead of time the group just pulled up expecting to get rooms, needless to say when they were stopped by the rangers they were already well cheesed off with the leader but they had paid up front. initially the leader denied he was a leader and that they were all on a ride out, (interviews were held individually and in private) however the leader had already asked me to stay schtumm, which I found impossible to do after hearing the stories of the others, however it was not my place to say or do anything just translate for the gendarmes and they are not silly. so they fined each of the bikers 800 euros with their bikes being held until payment was made, the leader had the book thrown at him he received a fine of 2000 euros plus 3 months in prison. When I last heard the remainder of the bikers were after him because he used their money to pay the fine!!!!and they were left in the lurch.
The outcome of this event is now being discussed at minister level to see if some kind of professional rating can be created for bikers riding in groups. So as usual the whole playing field is spoiled by the few.

[Tramp]

Okay so we have been told someone was a knob at last years ABR Hiss 2012 rally :whistle: hmy: ..not that it is really important to this thread :laugh: ..

Nice long post Britforg..but its hard reading without a Paragraph please..my eyes are bad enough already..

I know you have already stated your view on whats legal etc in France ..but for the sake of others who dont know could you please post a brief description..

main topic being rideouts....number restrictions in group?

who is actually responsible for the group of riders? both on road and trails?

maybe someone can explain the legality/description of a "French trail"..

is the Abr rally organiser responsible under French law for everyone else`s actions?

And if we all missbehave :whistle: ..how much we will have to cough up in Euro`s

Thanks in advance for helping enlighten soles aka "le Roastbeef" :cheer:

[AndyB]

The outcome of this event is now being discussed at minister level to see if some kind of professional rating can be created for bikers riding in groups. So as usual the whole playing field is spoiled by the few.

Pretty much the same as the groups of European riders that go to the IoM TT every year, cause accidents by getting pissed and forgetting which side of the road they're supposed to ride on and then go home and forget about it. That'd be about 40 out of 40,000 visitors then :pinch:

Get over it, nobody notices the thousands of riders from all countries that visit countries all over Europe and have a good time without annoying the locals.

This is supposed to be a forum for adventure bikers and to encourage people to get out there and do something different and exciting but an increasingly high percentage of posts criticise bikers when they've really not done anything wrong. Let's concentrate on the good things and the way the majority behave rather than pick out one muppet that really needs a bit of a slap to bring him back into line yet when someone browsing finds this forum they could easily think we're all a bunch of animals. I can't help but think that some of us want to load the bullets for the anti bikers to fire at us.

[Itispaul]

Being the person who attended the HISS last year and was unfortunate to crash and break my leg in 2 places and my ankle, receive several stitches to my arm and a torn ligament in my shoulder,I feel that the reference to myself is rather disingenuous.

Being referenced to on a thread with others who ride on trails that are prohibited and people riding/driving without mot/tax/insurance and being called a knob is getting out of hand.
Simon s right I didn't have my eu106, I had packed prescription exemption card by mistake and Simon may recall this is why handed over my credit card before they would attend to me. Private health, don’t know many who can afford this nowadays, and why would I have it. I had holiday insurance that did prove to be inadequate and like most insurances the details only become important when you have to claim. The restriction was for a 250cc bike, and taking out the insurance at no point was this made apparent. Others beware.

The experience has cost me dearly, the return to the uk was arduous and painful, the Spanish hospital had not diagnosed the broken ankle and I had to travel alone with my foot dangling out of the end of the plaster through the car journeys and the flight. I paid for the 3 seats on the plane £560, taxis £180, hotel £80, crutches £30 and medical bills.

12 months on and 3 operations with a leg in plaster for 8 months I still have a limp and haven’t worked for most of the year. Being a builder I have lost my living and am now placing our family home that I spent 3 years building on the market due to debt.

I am not telling anyone this for sympathy, but to maybe get people to think before they start posting on forums about individuals. Throughout the whole saga I have paid my own way, and not asked anything of anyone. I have not gone down the path of the claim culture we live in or blamed anyone but myself.

[Simon_100]

The outcome of this event is now being discussed at minister level to see if some kind of professional rating can be created for bikers riding in groups. So as usual the whole playing field is spoiled by the few.

Pretty much the same as the groups of European riders that go to the IoM TT every year, cause accidents by getting pissed and forgetting which side of the road they're supposed to ride on and then go home and forget about it. That'd be about 40 out of 40,000 visitors then :pinch:

Get over it, nobody notices the thousands of riders from all countries that visit countries all over Europe and have a good time without annoying the locals.

. . . .

I can't help but think that some of us want to load the bullets for the anti bikers to fire at us.

Andy,

I take your point entirely, but Nigel and I are talking about actual events that happen, and its the people who do them who are culpable.

This is especially important when it's our personal reputations that are at stake - how do you think I feel when I'm having a quiet drink in my local when the antics of Brits like the Saloufest comes on the news!

What I am talking about amounts to racial prejudice - in Spain all Brits are 'guirris' - i.e. dumb twats who deserve every rip-off they get - I have to face this most days of my life when I'm at work in the city and people don't know me, despite speaking Spanish and Catalan, because the overwhelming image of the Brits is exactly that; dumb drunken twats.

Yes, maybe everyone goes a bit loco when they're on holiday, think Swedes on the ferry to the Baltic States - it would be silly to pretend otherwise - but there's a time and place for everything.

What I see as being especially tragic is that the same mess that seems to apply to the British trail riding scen is being 'exported' by, guess who, the Brits!

None of this heavy stuff existed with the authorities just a couple of years ago - it simply cannot be a coincidence that with the phenomenal increase of biking popularity here - and totally unprofessional and unscrupulous 'guides' - that this 'paradise' is being spoilt almost before one's very own eyes.

I cannot emphasise too strongly how serious this issue is becoming here! This is nothing to do with anyone living here, on the ground, providing 'bullets for any group - quite the reverse. But the likes of Nigel and me are the few who may have the access to the local 'scene' to do something about it - but, to be frank, why bother. After all, I can ride around here 365/12 and don't need to share with anyone if I don't want to - there is the day job after all.

Regs

Simon