Chapel Gate to close for good

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-Ralph-
Posts: 6803
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:16 pm

Re: Chapel Gate to close for good

Post by -Ralph- » Tue May 20, 2014 5:23 pm

Fried Egg Sandwich wrote:
-Ralph- wrote:I'm not going to join the TRF (at this moment in time) because I haven't ridden more than the odd UK green lane as a shortcut or detour in about two years. You're absolutely right I don't really care what gets closed or what doesn't, and I think its a loosing battle, but I do like to stay abreast of developments. Much like I don't really care about most of what gets reported on the news, I still like to watch it.
-Ralph- that reminded me of the famous poem by MARTIN NIEMÖLLER

"First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me--and there was no one left to speak for me."

Don't "not" join the TRF because you don't ride green lanes now, join so that should you choose to in the future you still have the option to.
Longer post after dinner, but what makes you think that I didn't speak out, because I didn't give my money to the TRF?
"Luke, you're going to find that many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view" - Obi-Wan Kenobi

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Fried Egg Sandwich
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Re: Chapel Gate to close for good

Post by Fried Egg Sandwich » Tue May 20, 2014 5:44 pm

-Ralph- wrote:
Fried Egg Sandwich wrote:
-Ralph- wrote:I'm not going to join the TRF (at this moment in time) because I haven't ridden more than the odd UK green lane as a shortcut or detour in about two years. You're absolutely right I don't really care what gets closed or what doesn't, and I think its a loosing battle, but I do like to stay abreast of developments. Much like I don't really care about most of what gets reported on the news, I still like to watch it.
-Ralph- that reminded me of the famous poem by MARTIN NIEMÖLLER

"First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me--and there was no one left to speak for me."

Don't "not" join the TRF because you don't ride green lanes now, join so that should you choose to in the future you still have the option to.
Longer post after dinner, but what makes you think that I didn't speak out, because I didn't give my money to the TRF?
The text highlighted above is what kind of gave me the impression you didn't.
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"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." Edmund Burke Irish orator, philosopher, & politician (1729 - 1797)



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-Ralph-
Posts: 6803
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:16 pm

Re: Chapel Gate to close for good

Post by -Ralph- » Tue May 20, 2014 5:52 pm

OK, dinner eaten.

I did speak out against this lane closure, I wrote to MP's, filled in lengthy objections on online portals, signed petitions, etc, etc. In fact every thing the TRF have asked the members of this forum to do to help, I've done it.

I didn't do it because I was speaking out for myself. I've never ridden Chapel Gate and I probably wasn't ever likely to even if it did stay open.

I think Chapel Gate has been the highest profile green lane battle ever, with the most resources ever thrown at it by both sides?

And it's closed. We lost.

The Anti's have won a small victory, but the real winners here have been the lawyers. And they got paid with YOUR money, either your TRF memberships or from the PDNPA's purse and hence your taxes.

Not joining the TRF is not a case of not speaking out. Sometimes in life you have to pick your battles, and fight the ones you think you can win. I don't think we can win, if the authorities in this country want to ban green laning, they will. There are many more voters who want us off the lanes, than there are trail riders who want to keep them open. The TRF may slow them down lane by lane with legal challenges, but all that will result in the legislation being changed so that the TRF no longer have a legal ground upon which to fight, and even more lawyers will go on Caribbean holidays as a result.

That doesn't mean that we become the trodden minority, far from it. History shows that the more draconian and unreasonable you make the law, the more the reasonable law abiding man will break it. Who adheres to the blanket 50 mph limits in Warwickshire and Derbyshire? Nobody that I know. It's ridiculous therefore people just ignore it and carry on at 60 like they always have.

Somebody said earlier in this thread, wait until the PDNPA close the rest and it becomes a free for all, they wont know what hit them. And it's true. The Police don't have the resources to police every byway, bridleway and footpath in the country. They can't get to your house until the burglars have helped themselves and are long gone. Good luck to any farmer calling the police because I'm riding down one of his farm tracks. If this country shits on the law abiding trail rider, the trail riders are just going to shit all over this country.

A wise man once said 'ain't broke don't fix it', because you'll just break it even more, shame our public authorities and politicians never seem to learn that.
"Luke, you're going to find that many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view" - Obi-Wan Kenobi

-Ralph-
Posts: 6803
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:16 pm

Re: Chapel Gate to close for good

Post by -Ralph- » Tue May 20, 2014 5:56 pm

-Ralph- wrote:You're absolutely right I don't really care what gets closed or what doesn't, and I think its a loosing battle
Fried Egg Sandwich wrote:The text highlighted above is what kind of gave me the impression you didn't.
I don't care what gets closed, because from this point forwards, it's not going to stop me riding it.
"Luke, you're going to find that many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view" - Obi-Wan Kenobi

AndyB
Posts: 8747
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 2010 12:04 pm

Re: Chapel Gate to close for good

Post by AndyB » Tue May 20, 2014 7:14 pm

-Ralph- wrote:
-Ralph- wrote:You're absolutely right I don't really care what gets closed or what doesn't, and I think its a loosing battle
Fried Egg Sandwich wrote:The text highlighted above is what kind of gave me the impression you didn't.
I don't care what gets closed, because from this point forwards, it's not going to stop me riding it.
Really? Are you honestly going to go out and ride on lanes that you know are closed for whatever reason or are you just going to say you'll do it but not go through with it?

Personally I'll carry on fighting the closures, lobbying my MP about current issues like the Deregulation Bill and putting money into organisations that are listened to rather than saying I'll ride where I want no matter what the local authorities (backed by the courts) say and not actually doing it.

I've no doubt in my mind that eventually actions that break the law will have to take place to highlight what's happening but it's got to be better to do it in a large group (much the same way as the Mass Trespass was carried out) with the spotlight on whatever action it is so that more people know why it's being done than have your bike crushed for doing it alone.

It's your choice but I hope you don't end up with your bike in the crusher and you in court just because you think the TRF are a clique and you don't want to be part of it.

-Ralph-
Posts: 6803
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:16 pm

Re: Chapel Gate to close for good

Post by -Ralph- » Tue May 20, 2014 8:16 pm

AndyB wrote:It's your choice but I hope you don't end up with your bike in the crusher and you in court just because you think the TRF are a clique and you don't want to be part of it.
Where on earth do you dream up your perceptions from? Where did I say the TRF were a clique?

The comment about secrets was a joke, which is why it had a "LOL" after it (stands for "Lots of Laughs" BTW) (and that stands for "By The Way", by the way). The joke about secrets was made because you said I had to join to find out what their view on the Chapel Gate closure was.

I wish the TRF every success, I really do, but I don't believe it's my money well spent. My choice, free country! (thumbs)

As for me riding closed lanes, what makes you think I won't do it? As for me in court and my bike crushed, it'll never happen. Personally I think obeying the law simply because it's the law is the action of a sheep, and the authorities are the shepherds. We could have the same debate about Double White Lines, or Speeding, or anything else that's against the law. I don't necessarily have a problem with law breaking, so long as I haven't harmed anyone else by doing so. Doing it in numbers only happens because people think there is safety in numbers so they are more prepared to take the risk of being caught.
"Luke, you're going to find that many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view" - Obi-Wan Kenobi

Heavysnake
Posts: 34
Joined: Mon May 05, 2014 9:34 am

Re: Chapel Gate to close for good

Post by Heavysnake » Wed May 21, 2014 9:59 pm

Well what a day it's been. Had a blast. Going up chapels gate on my gs, what an amazing trail I just don't understand why anyone would close it.

I went from left to right going up the rocks, and on the way back as I was going over the jumps. The TRF said be careful one jump hAs a bend in it, we'll I bet u all can guess what happens next, yep right in the ditch. Had an amazing time. And for my 1st trip out as a trf member. What a blast.
I just can't get other how nice, friendly and supportive every one was. If you remember me please add me as a friend

Pictures to come later

NDC.
Posts: 1171
Joined: Mon May 16, 2011 7:05 pm

Re: Chapel Gate to close for good

Post by NDC. » Thu May 22, 2014 5:22 am

Good stuff, glad you had chance to do it. It was you in the photos getting a helping hand up the steps then on the TRF page? (thumbs)




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Heavysnake
Posts: 34
Joined: Mon May 05, 2014 9:34 am

Re: Chapel Gate to close for good

Post by Heavysnake » Thu May 22, 2014 8:22 am

Yes lol.

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