Brexit finally happens

[Tonibe63]

We are where we are and no amount of falling out on ABR is going to change the position the majority of voters wanted.
Regardless of which side of the argument you sit on there will be repercussions to be suffered on both sides ....... to what extent and at what timetable nobody knows. We all need to realise that there is no win or lose in this very long saga and there are many surprises to come but I hope that acceptance, understanding and compromise will eventually prevail because history shows us that political extremes are never good for a country or it's people.
The Tories are in a majority for the first 4 or 5 years of this Brexit stage and I hope that Boris manages to keep things more central and not let the right wing take over.
On my first trip to Morocco I met a guy who was shortly to leave to get married. Three years later I met him again and he told me that he (a muslim) had married a Catholic girl. When I asked "how does that work" he said "there is no right or wrong just a difference that needs acceptance, understanding and compromise to work" ........ very appropriate for a more understanding and inclusive society.

[garyboy]

I just read up a bit about the Transition Period for Brexit … things have changed so much along the way that I got confused ..
The transition period will be the 11 months following the WAB, (assuming it is all fully passed ok, by Jan 31, 2020) .. so will last from Jan 31st until the end of this year, Dec 31st, 2020.
During this transition period, free trade negotiations etc will occur with the EU, but also with US and others.
After Dec 31 2020 we go it alone, regain full sovereignty (presumably), and can trade with whom we wish, as EU laws and restrictions (and present benefits) and huge payments, will then no longer apply.

please correct me if I am wrong

[garyboy]

Personally, I always fancied living in France, for the climate and the French attitude to life and to biking, as well as the fab French countryside views etc etc etc.

I suppose I was always a bit of a wilting willow in making big steps, and always thought the idea of living abroad, while very appealing, was also fraught with some degree of danger, which eventually has proved to be the case, though this may be less adverse then anticipated by many, and could turn out to be still beneficial, though I admit to being an optimist and believer of human good will, which has proved my downfall on many life occasions.

There was also `work` .. that nasty but necessary four letter word, .. which basically, allowed me to ride a bike, drive, and consume alcohol in an unhealthy and constant manner, laced with chips and the occasional curry at the end of a lonely evening in the local. (yes I know its pathetic, but I lived alone at that time)

Events happened, as to us all, and I found myself being the carer for my mother .. this lasted ten years .. the ten years I should have been `living it up` on early retirement, which was enforced by lack of ready work. Obviously I had to give up the alcohol, in later stages, as I was a 24 hour carer .. but at least I feel proud that I did something useful and altruistic for once in my life in caring for my mother, as I know for a fact she would not have lived for so long in the care system, had she been admitted to a care home earlier. After her passing, I still have not fully recovered from the experience, even 4 years later, though I feel a great deal more positive recently, my new Ebike being a real boon to my mental health and fitness.

I still feel very envious of people who were emotionally able to make the great leap to living abroad, and feel they have had a great benefit in living that dream, even if for only several years... but feel a bit aggrieved to `hear` them whinge about their present temporary situation, which I feel sure will improve.

[daveuprite]

but feel a bit aggrieved to `hear` them whinge about their present temporary situation, which I feel sure will improve.

It's not temporary, Gary. You don't seem to be aware that before brexit I am an EU member state citizen. After brexit I am a TCN (third country national) living within the EU. That difference has profound implications for my status living in France and for the rights and access to services that I had before brexit. Trying to downplay and diminish the exclusively negative effects of brexit does not work for those of us stuck with consequences thrust upon us by others against our will. False optimism is of no use to me right now.

And you want me to stop complaining about this injustice so that you don't feel 'aggrieved at my whinging' ? Seriously?

[garyboy]

Hiya Dave …. yes I plead guilty to unfortunately possessing a false sense of optimism .. and also to being born with a misplaced commitment to loyalty to people and firms that dont deserve it .. as well as believing in the goodness of mankind .. all of which often leave me in great distress and an unfortunately cynical attitude, …..... all of which can evaporate temporarily with a good rideout on the bike or emtb.

but I think you should stop whinging about brexit so that I personally can feel a lot better

do it for ME, Dave …..


seriously though .. negotiations have not finished yet, and i hope that your, and others' situations can be improved ….
look on the bright side .. unlike myself and many other downtrodden Brits at home.. … you still got all that lovely weather, food, views, French people, trails, roads, mates, good times, your misses, a place to live, work to do etc etc …….

live .. enjoy it

[daveuprite]

Hiya Dave …. yes I plead guilty to unfortunately possessing a false sense of optimism .. and also to being born with a misplaced commitment to loyalty to people and firms that dont deserve it .. as well as believing in the goodness of mankind .. all of which often leave me in great distress and an unfortunately cynical attitude, …..... all of which can evaporate temporarily with a good rideout on the bike or emtb.

but I think you should stop whinging about brexit so that I personally can feel a lot better

do it for ME, Dave …..


seriously though .. negotiations have not finished yet, and i hope that your, and others' situations can be improved ….
look on the bright side .. unlike myself and many other downtrodden Brits at home.. … you still got all that lovely weather, food, views, French people, trails, roads, mates, good times, your misses, a place to live, work to do etc etc …….

live .. enjoy it

Oh yes, don't get me wrong. Complaining about brexit is not the same as complaining about everything. There are huge number of advantages to living here - which is why we moved over 12 years ago.

We have our Carte De Sejours cards now, which gives us residency rights at least - so lucky for brits I won't be going back to the UK. That was 3.5kgs of paperwork and weeks of compiling / translating documents. After 31st Jan we will have to exchange those for a new proof of residency, now that brexit is definitely going ahead. Then there are driving licences to change etc etc. All unnecessary before brexit. I think I'm going to wait until the end of the transition period to see if Johnson manages to cobble together an inferior 'trade deal' and hopefully saves the UK from a no deal crash out, which I think is still quite possible. If there is some kind of deal signed, let's see what that consists of. If not, Tracie and I will go for full French nationality, because being a TCN in a no deal situation would not be good. That means 2 - 3 years of applications, upgrading our french, taking tests, home police check, oral exam (ooh err...) etc etc. But not enough to persuade us to return to the UK - no way.

I feel a bit sorry for some of the brits who settled here kind of 'under the radar'. Sure, they should have paid their taxes, registered their businesses, and the rest f it - but none of them can have anticipated brexit - which now forces them to declare all their tax history, bills, proof of habitation etc. Quite a few in this category are selling up quick and doing a flit back to blighty (where I guess HMRC will have questions for them too...). I'm just glad that we bought a large filing cabinet when we came here and kept every bloody electric bill, document, cheque book, bank statement etc - because we have needed most of them.

Anyway, I have to bow out of this conversation now because ironically I'm off to Dorset for four days. Looking forward to a proper pint of Guinness, mind...

[Spike941]

The transition period will be the 11 months following the WAB, (assuming it is all fully passed ok, by Jan 31, 2020) .. so will last from Jan 31st until the end of this year, Dec 31st, 2020.
During this transition period, free trade negotiations etc will occur with the EU, but also with US and others.
After Dec 31 2020 we go it alone, regain full sovereignty (presumably), and can trade with whom we wish, as EU laws and restrictions (and present benefits) and huge payments, will then no longer apply.

That all sounds pretty straightforward, what could possibly go wrong? I do hope you’re right Garyboy, but shall continue to keep my fingers crossed as an extra insurance policy, and look forward to all these post Brexit benefits I hear talk of. Let’s just hope everyone’s happy with the deal, if and when it’s reached, but I guess there’s still a hard core who won’t be happy unless it’s no deal. So as you say, enjoy what we have now, and make the most of what we get later, as one day it’ll be all gone.

[bill_qaz]

Is this post(s) still going
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The problem is, a wafer thin majority of the electorate four years ago voted for a decade or more of disruption to their own economy and culture. So don't be surprised that others have a problem with that. Brexit ain't going away for a LONG time. You could say "You won, now live with it"!


I didn't win Dave but I will have live with it good or bad

[qcnr]

Someone above used Norway as an example of how well a country can thrive outside the EU. Crazy. It's as if all the last 4 years of debate and argument has been for nothing. Norway is the perfect example of a 'vassal state', which is outside the EU in name but which adheres to almost every EU rule without any say over how EU policy is made. If that is a model for how the UK should be in future, the whole nonsense of brexit and the massive economic damage it has already caused, will have been utterly pointless, and of no satisfaction to the brexiteers.

Irony is lost on some people....

[qcnr]

Well I went to an info meeting yesterday organised by the British Embassy, here in Norway.
My conclusion is I am applying for a Norwegian passport, because after 01.01.2021, as a brit
you may as well have an Iranian passport if you want to travel and live within the EU.