Finally something sensible from our government! Might vote to keep this lot!

Anything goes, and mine's a Guinness.
Ianuk
Posts: 59
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 1:43 pm

Re: Finally something sensible from our government! Might vote to keep this lot!

Post by Ianuk »

I've always looked as unemployment benefits as a wage. Your paid to look for work or in my opinion you should have to work a certain number of hours per week for it. Helping in local community projects, volunteering in old peoples homes, work experience, further studies or even litter picking. I'm sure those who were on long term unemployment would soon get a job if they had to work for their benefits.

I drive into London a couple of times a week, as you get closer and closer the roads become more and more litter strewn.. I'm sure that would benefit everyone and give a pride in the community... Or am I just mad..?
chico
Posts: 643
Joined: Thu Dec 26, 2013 8:05 pm

Re: Finally something sensible from our government! Might vote to keep this lot!

Post by chico »

AndyB wrote:
chico wrote:I would have no problem with working for any benefits I may ever have to claim....as long as it was at minimum wage and the hours added up to the amount of benefit I was receiving, otherwise i'd be wondering who were the scroungers........



but as said....i'll never vote left or right again...its just tiresome now....
The point about the minimum wage is my biggest concern. I don't trust this mob of self serving grabbers not to just use unemployed people as a cheap resource.

that was exactly my point in a roundabout way, they'd be quick to call them scroungers, and quicker to make a fast buck out of them....is it any wonder people play the system.....monkey see, monkey do, I cant be arsed with either side of the argument anymore... spongers and grabbers, both just playing the system...

the amount of "respectable" people I come across who are quite happy to slag off the unemployed and then hire them on the cheap to do work are just as bad, when it come s to money, talk is cheap..... :whistle:


whenever ive found myself out of work, either redundancy or whatever, ive signed straight up at college to do a course of some kind, you usually get a subsidy, and you're being positive in a negative situation...while looking for something else
chico
Posts: 643
Joined: Thu Dec 26, 2013 8:05 pm

Re: Finally something sensible from our government! Might vote to keep this lot!

Post by chico »

-Ralph- wrote:
Zookman wrote:People just want jobs where they wont be living on the breadline.... which is not much to ask.
So what if they can't find that job? Or they have to retrain? I think they should have to do the breadline job as a short term thing to tide them over. Staying on benefits because you can't find the job you want shouldn't be an option IMHO.
Lets not forget, this isn't aimed at somebody made redundant and needing the time to get back on their feet, and this doesn't affect those on disability or others who genuinely can't work. This only affects those on Jobseekers Allowance for more than three years.

i'd agree with that, but i'd also say that if a company can't provide stability for its workforce....its a failure, and shouldn't be allowed to dump them onto benefits without the same rigour....its just a chicken and egg situation to me, genuine businesses fail and so do genuine people sometimes.....and others take advantage

seems to me neither party can get it right
bull
Posts: 2481
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2012 11:21 am

Re: Finally something sensible from our government! Might vote to keep this lot!

Post by bull »

well, I didn't read all that news paper page

but anyway, this is my view,

if you do a days work, then you should get a days pay

you just cant expect people to work for noting



simple as
-Ralph-
Posts: 6803
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:16 pm

Re: Finally something sensible from our government! Might vote to keep this lot!

Post by -Ralph- »

I kind of agree that you should get a days pay for a days work, but then how do you differentiate then between someone who went out and found themselves a minimum wage job and works hard at it, and those who were given one by the state because they'd been unemployed for three years and they spend the day slacking off wherever possible. It would become even easier to sponge off benefits, do nothing for three years and get benefits, and at the end of if the state gives you a job with a proper wage. There has to be some motivation to get off you arse and find yourself something better, outside of the state provided programme.

Its all very well to go all bleeding heart and say the government and media are prejudice, but a polish person can arrive in this country, and find themselves a cleaning job or similar within a couple of weeks, so why do we have people on jobseekers for 3 years in the first place?
"Luke, you're going to find that many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view" - Obi-Wan Kenobi
-Ralph-
Posts: 6803
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:16 pm

Re: Finally something sensible from our government! Might vote to keep this lot!

Post by -Ralph- »

So according to the graph in this article there are about 1,150,000 people claiming jobseekers, of which about 150,000 have been claiming for more than two years.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... wance.html

This only affects people over the three years, so lets say it's 100,000 people.

There are 600,000 vacancies in the jobs market at any one time.

Thats 6 job vacancies available, for every 1 jobseeker affected by this programme.

Why is it the other million people managed to find a job and get themselves off jobseekers within the two year period? Either these people are failing, or the system is failing them.
"Luke, you're going to find that many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view" - Obi-Wan Kenobi
AndyB
Posts: 8747
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 2010 12:04 pm
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: Finally something sensible from our government! Might vote to keep this lot!

Post by AndyB »

I'm sure I've explained before what the most common scenario is when it comes to East Europeans getting jobs in preference to local labour but I'll do it again just for fun.

A large number of agency jobs pay minimum wage.
The agencies offer the East Europeans a deal with accommodation and transport to work as part of the package with costs deducted from their wages.
The agencies pay another East European minimum wage to drive the mini bus full of workers to the Amazon distribution centre or wherever it is they're working.
The agency rakes in the cash for transport and accommodation with 8-10 workers sharing a house owned by the agency each being charged £200 month rent in a house costing £600 month to rent.

Now ask yourself why the local looking for work gets knocked back even if they're willing to work for the minimum wage? This isn't fiction; it's what happens in every town where there are a load of distribution centres dotted around in a 10 mile radius. The employers score cheap labour, the agencies rake it in from every direction, the East European get's what to them is a cracking deal and the school leaver gets shat on.
Fordy
Posts: 299
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2013 8:43 pm

Re: Finally something sensible from our government! Might vote to keep this lot!

Post by Fordy »

bull wrote:well, I didn't read all that news paper page

but anyway, this is my view,

if you do a days work, then you should get a days pay

you just cant expect people to work for noting



simple as
I didn't read it either.

If you collect benefit you should earn it.

You can't expect people to take taxpayers money for doing nothing.

Simple as.


Except it never is.
-Ralph-
Posts: 6803
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:16 pm

Re: Finally something sensible from our government! Might vote to keep this lot!

Post by -Ralph- »

Even if eastern europeans are taking the jobs, the fact remains that 90% of those claiming jobseekers do so for less than three years, so its not impossible for that 90% to find work within that timescale. That tells me there something going wrong with the other 10%!

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk
"Luke, you're going to find that many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view" - Obi-Wan Kenobi
bull
Posts: 2481
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2012 11:21 am

Re: Finally something sensible from our government! Might vote to keep this lot!

Post by bull »

Fordy wrote:
I didn't read it either.

If you collect benefit you should earn it.

You can't expect people to take taxpayers money for doing nothing.

Simple as.


Except it never is.

but, it is that simple

you want someone to work, thats fine, but pay them the going rate for that job

a days work, for a days pay


simple as :S
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