Why so expensive?

[daveuprite]

Problem with this discussion is that it soon becomes the same old yawning discussion about 'the good old days'. When the 98 R1 came out people said "nobody needs 150bhp in a road bike blah blah". When the 92 Fireblade came out some people said "it's too light and insubstantial - only any good for racing". Yada yada...

Of course proper scrotes and racers alike said "yes please, the lighter the better, definitely better suspension too thanks and yes let's have a load more power while you're at it". In years of club and endurance racing I certainly never met a racer who turned down a better handling more powerful bike!

At the end of the day, if you want to stay broadly within legal road speed limits and never scare yourself too much then fine - you don't need an R1 anyway (old or new). But if I wanted to rag an R1 today on the open roads in all weathers I would happily accept all the modern rider aids available so that I could have a great time and be safer simultaneously. The logic of rejecting them is the Monty Python rose-tinted nostalgia argument. "Back in my day we just had steam power and an anchor for brakes and it never did us any harm...Yawn!"

OK it's a commonplace feature of growing old that people reject progress and pour scorn on the 'young whipper snappers' who enjoy it, usually forgetting that that was them once. Which is a shame because in many ways we are living through a golden age of power and control for petrol-heads which is about to end and you would think they would embrace it before it's all gone. Personally I welcome the new electric age with open arms, but for the many electro-phobes out there I don't understand why they're not revelling in all this last-gasp excess of power while they still can.

[garyboy]

Well said







You young wippersnapper (possibly )

[garyboy]

Only last year. I was into 'old' retro air cooled and steam powered if I could have got it. But I was called a boring old fart on here . I was having problems with my one do it all bike anyway so flipped to 'new'.

I am glad I did and would welcome electronic aids and futures advances.

Although I miss my old blade 954 for its performance. it was too light (164kg) for fast open roads with sidewinds. My old pan was better in this respect but corners had to be planned well ahead.

So with advances in bike performance. probably an increase in weight is needed for high speed stability and control. More power. .. stronger frame. bigger brakes. bigger fairing. heavier lump etc

Yes as above. grab while the golden age is still here. But many lighter retro bikes and smaller bikes are also becoming available .

We are really spoilt these days


Cost? ... yeah!! .. but we only live twice ; )

[captinktm]

Problem with this discussion is that it soon becomes the same old yawning discussion about 'the good old days'. When the 98 R1 came out people said "nobody needs 150bhp in a road bike blah blah". When the 92 Fireblade came out some people said "it's too light and insubstantial - only any good for racing". Yada yada...

Of course proper scrotes and racers alike said "yes please, the lighter the better, definitely better suspension too thanks and yes let's have a load more power while you're at it". In years of club and endurance racing I certainly never met a racer who turned down a better handling more powerful bike!

At the end of the day, if you want to stay broadly within legal road speed limits and never scare yourself too much then fine - you don't need an R1 anyway (old or new). But if I wanted to rag an R1 today on the open roads in all weathers I would happily accept all the modern rider aids available so that I could have a great time and be safer simultaneously. The logic of rejecting them is the Monty Python rose-tinted nostalgia argument. "Back in my day we just had steam power and an anchor for brakes and it never did us any harm...Yawn!"

OK it's a commonplace feature of growing old that people reject progress and pour scorn on the 'young whipper snappers' who enjoy it, usually forgetting that that was them once. Which is a shame because in many ways we are living through a golden age of power and control for petrol-heads which is about to end and you would think they would embrace it before it's all gone. Personally I welcome the new electric age with open arms, but for the many electro-phobes out there I don't understand why they're not revelling in all this last-gasp excess of power while they still can.

Who you calling a scrote? It's nothing to do with growing old yuh cheaky young varmit. How many 20k super bikes are ridden by young people? None! As for turning down power, who even said that. What I said was I did n't come in from a ride thinking I could do with more than 150 bhp on the road!! I am not an electro phobe, I am a 20k for a bike that for me at least would be no more full filling than the old one phobe.
My point is this. With 150 bhp delivered by carbs or injection if they can ever replicate the carbs smooth ness, does n't need TC to control it. I say again the only reason they developed the electronic's is because the buying public could not control 200 bhp on the road. You ask why we are not all reveling in this EXCESS of power (so why have it) I'll tell you why. 20k which is what the post was about.

[DavidS]

Technology for technology's sake is totally pointless.
As an old git, i still want better handling, suspension, performance and reliability than my 51 year old Triumph, which I would only use for short fun trips anyway.
I am certainly no luddite.

Sports bikes are and always have been too much for UK roads and speed limits.
If you want to ride like Ago/Rea, do track days.
I do admit to wondering how brainless high speed is over here these days. Broken roads, mud, farm vehicles, moronic drivers and phone users or mums feeding children mean going too fast is too risky.
Back in my day (sorry) roads were better and massively less busy so speed was less of an issue.

I have had my share of quick (not stupid quick) cars and bikes and loved them but probably, like most people, only used 60% of their ability anyway. The only time I hit the rev limiter is on a missed gear.

[daveuprite]

Problem with this discussion is that it soon becomes the same old yawning discussion about 'the good old days'. When the 98 R1 came out people said "nobody needs 150bhp in a road bike blah blah". When the 92 Fireblade came out some people said "it's too light and insubstantial - only any good for racing". Yada yada...

Of course proper scrotes and racers alike said "yes please, the lighter the better, definitely better suspension too thanks and yes let's have a load more power while you're at it". In years of club and endurance racing I certainly never met a racer who turned down a better handling more powerful bike!

At the end of the day, if you want to stay broadly within legal road speed limits and never scare yourself too much then fine - you don't need an R1 anyway (old or new). But if I wanted to rag an R1 today on the open roads in all weathers I would happily accept all the modern rider aids available so that I could have a great time and be safer simultaneously. The logic of rejecting them is the Monty Python rose-tinted nostalgia argument. "Back in my day we just had steam power and an anchor for brakes and it never did us any harm...Yawn!"

OK it's a commonplace feature of growing old that people reject progress and pour scorn on the 'young whipper snappers' who enjoy it, usually forgetting that that was them once. Which is a shame because in many ways we are living through a golden age of power and control for petrol-heads which is about to end and you would think they would embrace it before it's all gone. Personally I welcome the new electric age with open arms, but for the many electro-phobes out there I don't understand why they're not revelling in all this last-gasp excess of power while they still can.

Who you calling a scrote? It's nothing to do with growing old yuh cheaky young varmit. How many 20k super bikes are ridden by young people? None! As for turning down power, who even said that. What I said was I did n't come in from a ride thinking I could do with more than 150 bhp on the road!! I am not an electro phobe, I am a 20k for a bike that for me at least would be no more full filling than the old one phobe.
My point is this. With 150 bhp delivered by carbs or injection if they can ever replicate the carbs smooth ness, does n't need TC to control it. I say again the only reason they developed the electronic's is because the buying public could not control 200 bhp on the road. You ask why we are not all reveling in this EXCESS of power (so why have it) I'll tell you why. 20k which is what the post was about.

Luckily I don't really care about any of that. I've had 4 glasses of great cheap wine and David Attenborough just told me that a baby Puffin is called a 'puffling' - so none of it matters now...

[diggermanbob]

There is no apostrophe in the word electronics. That's all I wanted to say.

[diggermanbob]

Problem with this discussion is that it soon becomes the same old yawning discussion about 'the good old days'. When the 98 R1 came out people said "nobody needs 150bhp in a road bike blah blah". When the 92 Fireblade came out some people said "it's too light and insubstantial - only any good for racing". Yada yada...

Of course proper scrotes and racers alike said "yes please, the lighter the better, definitely better suspension too thanks and yes let's have a load more power while you're at it". In years of club and endurance racing I certainly never met a racer who turned down a better handling more powerful bike!

At the end of the day, if you want to stay broadly within legal road speed limits and never scare yourself too much then fine - you don't need an R1 anyway (old or new). But if I wanted to rag an R1 today on the open roads in all weathers I would happily accept all the modern rider aids available so that I could have a great time and be safer simultaneously. The logic of rejecting them is the Monty Python rose-tinted nostalgia argument. "Back in my day we just had steam power and an anchor for brakes and it never did us any harm...Yawn!"

OK it's a commonplace feature of growing old that people reject progress and pour scorn on the 'young whipper snappers' who enjoy it, usually forgetting that that was them once. Which is a shame because in many ways we are living through a golden age of power and control for petrol-heads which is about to end and you would think they would embrace it before it's all gone. Personally I welcome the new electric age with open arms, but for the many electro-phobes out there I don't understand why they're not revelling in all this last-gasp excess of power while they still can.

Who you calling a scrote? It's nothing to do with growing old yuh cheaky young varmit. How many 20k super bikes are ridden by young people? None! As for turning down power, who even said that. What I said was I did n't come in from a ride thinking I could do with more than 150 bhp on the road!! I am not an electro phobe, I am a 20k for a bike that for me at least would be no more full filling than the old one phobe.
My point is this. With 150 bhp delivered by carbs or injection if they can ever replicate the carbs smooth ness, does n't need TC to control it. I say again the only reason they developed the electronic's is because the buying public could not control 200 bhp on the road. You ask why we are not all reveling in this EXCESS of power (so why have it) I'll tell you why. 20k which is what the post was about.

Luckily I don't really care about any of that. I've had 4 glasses of great cheap wine and David Attenborough just told me that a baby Puffin is called a 'puffling' - so none of it matters now...

I hope it's a plastic glass you got your wine in Dave

[daveuprite]

I hope it's a plastic glass you got your wine in Dave

No, but one more and I'll probably smash it somewhere...

[chunky butt]

Nothing changed there then Dave time to pull the cork on one me self, especially with this shite weather