2018 crf 250 rally promoted at Japan show

[garyboy]

I suspect that the development costs (etc) of the 250cc and 1000cc are about the same?
The small one will be used globally, so the lower purchasing cost/unit is boosted by quantity of sales, (including the east)?
The big one is (will be) very popular for high-end sales, and the high purchasing cost/unit will bring smaller sales but higher profits/unit?
So both are justified? financially, for Honda.
An intermediate sized unit will cater for a niche market, in Honda's global eyes.? ?

I mean .. how many people in the world actually like potholes in the road, axles submerged in mud, steep slippy rock slopes, confrontations with farmers and police and wardens, .. drowning and scraping new bikes, abundant punctures, camping in the snow and rain and frost, sweating from excess effort, pushing .. .. ... ..

ps the above is a rhetorical question, please don't answer if you read ABR

[PaulinBont]

Having ridden your bike Gary (and been very impressed with it), and been threatened by a Para Regt RSM toting a very big gun, ridden through all the ruts , potholes and muddy assault courses up on Epynt with you, having had the time of my life.......i'd say quite a lot of us

[garyboy]

[Nitchjj]

I really like the change from the 2017 graphics on the 2018 model.....whenever It makes its actual release. The original blue made it look just cheap in my opinion. Luckily Ive been able to find many different cheap good quality graphics here in Thailand, I couldn't in the states or Europe. Even the HRC kit from the Bangkok rally release last year. Be interested to see if they've done anything to the engine otherwise I think I'm still happy with my 2017 model. A few picks of a kit I just put on........all be it I have changed the bike a bit from stock, one gets the picture.

[minkyhead]

i dont think anyone will invest the expense and time to bring out a mid range adv type bike ...i really hope they do but i seroiusly doubt it

the reason they go 250 is for licencing and taxation threasholds in a lot of target markets .they certainly havnt got europe on their radar ...the crf rally didnt even get a launch in europe ..it was never tragetted at euro riders

you only need to go to any bike meet and you will see a huge sea of roadbikes ....a smattering of gses and ktm adv ect but you will not see anything resembling a duel purpose bike and will struggle find much under 600cc

even the much lauded and lamented ktm 640 only sold 650 bikes in it last year and that was global sales ..???

lets face it we are a tiny tiny market the 310gs 250 vee strom and kawsaki 300 versys are what we are getting and thats simply because thats what will sell... so thats their take on mid size adv bikes

they are such a hard sell in the mainstream ...who other than a trail rider would be remotly interested in a 37hp 400cc single ..and if they did produce one 50 percent of their customers would not have the legs long enough to even sit on it and probaly 90 percent of all female riders are ruled out also ... the low engine specs and sheer height of a proper duelsport rule out so many people it makes no sense to make one there is not enough demand

that then leaves us with pretty much what we have got ..

took a few days off roading throu wales and devon a couple of weeks ago 1000 mile round trip i ended by riding back from plymouth on the 300 ... to southport it took five hours ...for the remainder of the 4 days the small bike was perfect for the route and to be fair it did a very respectable job of getting me home ....it bobbed along at 70 no trouble

..i think the small bike is the right bike for 90 percent of this kind of ride ..with the small engine comes short usable trail gears tiny turning circle and managable weight ..... if someone offered me a africa twin to do the same trip on for nothing ...id deffo turn em down i can have a load more fun on the rally than i ever would on a africa twin

crf 400 /450would be ace ..it wont happen though

DSC_0736 by minkyhead56, on Flickr

[minkyhead]

graphics look ace

[garyboy]

well .. to me, the old DR350 engine is/was great! .. I really miss that bike, but only for its engine .. the suspension and sheer height and brakes needed .. amending/upgrading. I think subsequent owners did some of that?
it could cruise easily at 70+ mph and had plenty of torque and power on trails. Even an old slowie like me would sometimes leave `better` bikes scampering on difficult slopes. (the Bike .. not me!)
but a new bike needs these euro things, emissions stuff, so water-cooled seems to be the norm now.
Probably, for motorway use, a bigger engine is going to be more appreciated .. say a 450cc? .. and CCM have done a superb job, at least in concept (low rev problems) .. but they have kept the weight down by using expensive and exotic? materials, and glue n stuff.

so what would be my ideal trail/adventure bike?
. water-cooled .. keeps better stable temperature,
. fuel injected .. nice a t low revs, smooth,
. 450cc .. ideal size, torque/power/weight,
. steel frame .. simple and strong, weight mitigated by low c o g,
. steel sub-frame .. to carry all that baggage (and ex's)
. low c o g .. flattish engine like the nc750 .. heavy, but easier to pick up, (upper parts light),
. variable seat height .. from Very Low .. to high, adjustable for (less than) 5`4" - 6-4" plus,
. small distance between seat and bash plate .. ruts!!
. low height of triple clamps region .. more stable? less likely to highside?,
. 8 gears .. is it really impossible though?,
. comfy seat .. must be flat and wide at bum, but narrow at legs?,
. spoked wheels but tubeless .. punctures a pain on TT tyres .. plug n go type repairs!,
. fuel tanks as per ccm450gp .. plus a large `real` tank for touring/long trail days,
. paniers (narrow) or panier rails as standard,
. heated grips as standard,
. flat seat level .. not this rear end high-up thing, (leg over easier),
. vg low but gentle torque at low revs .. but can rev fairly high for motorways, or pull a higher gear?,
. longish trail/rake .. better stability, and roll over of obstacles?
. long rear swing arm .. better stability, (- but reduced manoeuvrability),
. more ? ?

. radiators incorporated inside the bash zone .. I mean protected by their position, (narrower),
. minimal plastics,
. possibly a V-twin ? ?

[Nitchjj]

well .. to me, the old DR350 engine is/was great! .. I really miss that bike, but only for its engine .. the suspension and sheer height and brakes needed .. amending/upgrading. I think subsequent owners did some of that?
it could cruise easily at 70+ mph and had plenty of torque and power on trails. Even an old slowie like me would sometimes leave `better` bikes scampering on difficult slopes. (the Bike .. not me!)
but a new bike needs these euro things, emissions stuff, so water-cooled seems to be the norm now.
Probably, for motorway use, a bigger engine is going to be more appreciated .. say a 450cc? .. and CCM have done a superb job, at least in concept (low rev problems) .. but they have kept the weight down by using expensive and exotic? materials, and glue n stuff.

so what would be my ideal trail/adventure bike?
. water-cooled .. keeps better stable temperature,
. fuel injected .. nice a t low revs, smooth,
. 450cc .. ideal size, torque/power/weight,
. steel frame .. simple and strong, weight mitigated by low c o g,
. steel sub-frame .. to carry all that baggage (and ex's)
. low c o g .. flattish engine like the nc750 .. heavy, but easier to pick up, (upper parts light),
. variable seat height .. from Very Low .. to high, adjustable for (less than) 5`4" - 6-4" plus,
. small distance between seat and bash plate .. ruts!!
. low height of triple clamps region .. more stable? less likely to highside?,
. 8 gears .. is it really impossible though?,
. comfy seat .. must be flat and wide at bum, but narrow at legs?,
. spoked wheels but tubeless .. punctures a pain on TT tyres .. plug n go type repairs!,
. fuel tanks as per ccm450gp .. plus a large `real` tank for touring/long trail days,
. paniers (narrow) or panier rails as standard,
. heated grips as standard,
. flat seat level .. not this rear end high-up thing, (leg over easier),
. vg low but gentle torque at low revs .. but can rev fairly high for motorways, or pull a higher gear?,
. longish trail/rake .. better stability, and roll over of obstacles?
. long rear swing arm .. better stability, (- but reduced manoeuvrability),
. more ? ?

. radiators incorporated inside the bash zone .. I mean protected by their position, (narrower),
. minimal plastics,
. possibly a V-twin ? ?

I'll take two when you find this holy grail trail bike!!!

[garyboy]

DSC_0736 by minkyhead56, on Flickr

.. only just realised this is a video

explains a lot!